Elon Musk on Innovation, Free Speech, and the Future of Civilization

00:01my first guest is the man who made my first guest is the man who made electric cars a thing electric cars a thing electric cars a thing and is currently working on perfecting and is currently working on perfecting and is currently working on perfecting reusable Rockets space travel connecting reusable Rockets space travel connecting reusable Rockets space travel connecting the human brain directly to computers the human brain directly to computers the human brain directly to computers connecting cities with electromagnetic connecting cities with electromagnetic connecting cities with electromagnetic bullet trains the Starling satellite bullet trains the Starling satellite

00:13bullet trains the Starling satellite system that's so important to the war in system that's so important to the war in system that's so important to the war in Ukraine and then on Tuesday

00:23on traffic he also tweets a lot Elon on traffic he also tweets a lot Elon Musk wow wow [Music]

00:42what did I get the full order of things what did I get the full order of things that you do in a day there when I was that you do in a day there when I was that you do in a day there when I was reading there I left out the tunnel reading there I left out the tunnel reading there I left out the tunnel thing at the end um do you work on all thing at the end um do you work on all thing at the end um do you work on all these a lot of jobs do you do all these these a lot of jobs do you do all these these a lot of jobs do you do all these things every day do you work on all of things every day do you work on all of things every day do you work on all of them in a single day no no but I do have

00:54them in a single day no no but I do have them in a single day no no but I do have I do have a long work day I do have a long work day I do have a long work day um yeah so um yeah so um yeah so I work a lot I'm so thrilled you're here because you I'm so thrilled you're here because you know we do a show where we talk about know we do a show where we talk about know we do a show where we talk about what changes happen in the world and but what changes happen in the world and but what changes happen in the world and but we just talk there's a very few people we just talk there's a very few people we just talk there's a very few people who actually make change happen you are

01:14who actually make change happen you are who actually make change happen you are one of those people probably

01:23um you know um you know I just want to say I just want to say I I just want to say I just want to say I I just want to say I just want to say I love this audience love this audience love this audience [Applause] well you're a likable guy I mean thanks well you're a likable guy I mean thanks I mean they attack you a lot they do I mean they attack you a lot they do I mean they attack you a lot they do yeah yeah yeah [Laughter] [Laughter] [Laughter] and you seem to laugh it off which I and you seem to laugh it off which I and you seem to laugh it off which I think is fantastic I love it that you think is fantastic I love it that you

01:41think is fantastic I love it that you have a sense of humor because a guy as have a sense of humor because a guy as have a sense of humor because a guy as important as you who makes changes could important as you who makes changes could important as you who makes changes could use your powers for evil and not good use your powers for evil and not good use your powers for evil and not good the fact that absolutely you could the fact that absolutely you could the fact that absolutely you could of course I would yeah never use them of course I would yeah never use them of course I would yeah never use them for equal deaths no I know but but the for equal deaths no I know but but the

01:58for equal deaths no I know but but the way I know that is because you have a way I know that is because you have a way I know that is because you have a sense of humor uh yeah you really do sense of humor uh yeah you really do sense of humor uh yeah you really do yeah you like laughing you like to be yeah you like laughing you like to be yeah you like laughing you like to be funny I kill me right funny I kill me right funny I kill me right [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] as opposed to somebody like Zuckerberg as opposed to somebody like Zuckerberg as opposed to somebody like Zuckerberg who I'm not even sure is a real boy yeah yeah um

02:26yeah I I actually love comedy and and uh yeah I I actually love comedy and and uh actually you know like um many years ago actually you know like um many years ago actually you know like um many years ago actually was in the audience here and actually was in the audience here and actually was in the audience here and watched your show oh really been a long watched your show oh really been a long watched your show oh really been a long time admirer of your show oh well thank time admirer of your show oh well thank time admirer of your show oh well thank you you you I let me get back to you being ingenious let me get back to you being ingenious okay but that has always been my view is

02:44okay but that has always been my view is okay but that has always been my view is that as I was a history major and when that as I was a history major and when that as I was a history major and when you study history what you realize is you study history what you realize is you study history what you realize is that you know there's the great man that you know there's the great man that you know there's the great man Theory and they talk about Kings and Theory and they talk about Kings and Theory and they talk about Kings and princes and queens and presidents it's princes and queens and presidents it's princes and queens and presidents it's really the people in Tech who change the

02:57really the people in Tech who change the really the people in Tech who change the world they're the people who deal the world they're the people who deal the world they're the people who deal the cards at whether it's fire or cards at whether it's fire or cards at whether it's fire or electricity for good or bad or the electricity for good or bad or the electricity for good or bad or the cotton gin or the iPhone or the atom cotton gin or the iPhone or the atom cotton gin or the iPhone or the atom bomb those are the cards and the rest of bomb those are the cards and the rest of bomb those are the cards and the rest of us just play it would you agree with us just play it would you agree with

03:13us just play it would you agree with that assessment that assessment that assessment I think I think technology is the thing I think I think technology is the thing I think I think technology is the thing that causes these big step changes in in that causes these big step changes in in that causes these big step changes in in Civilization so obviously you've got Civilization so obviously you've got Civilization so obviously you've got things like say the Gutenberg Press things like say the Gutenberg Press things like say the Gutenberg Press um before which uh right it was very um before which uh right it was very um before which uh right it was very difficult to get books they were very

03:28difficult to get books they were very difficult to get books they were very rare even if you had a thirst for rare even if you had a thirst for rare even if you had a thirst for knowledge you really couldn't do knowledge you really couldn't do knowledge you really couldn't do anything about it anything about it anything about it um because there were very few books to um because there were very few books to um because there were very few books to read so read so read so uh and the the internet is something uh and the the internet is something uh and the the internet is something beyond beyond the bug price I think but beyond beyond the bug price I think but

03:41beyond beyond the bug price I think but you know it's it's a you know it's it's a you know it's it's a like when I first saw the internet uh like when I first saw the internet uh like when I first saw the internet uh coming into being in a way that that the coming into being in a way that that the coming into being in a way that that the general public could use it it felt like general public could use it it felt like general public could use it it felt like the what the the humanity as a whole was the what the the humanity as a whole was the what the the humanity as a whole was uh uh uh developing a nervous system so developing a nervous system so

03:56developing a nervous system so previously uh the way the information previously uh the way the information previously uh the way the information would travel would be by osmosis one would travel would be by osmosis one would travel would be by osmosis one person to another or one person calling person to another or one person calling person to another or one person calling another another another um but uh um but uh um but uh you did the access to information was you did the access to information was you did the access to information was very limited now with the Internet it's very limited now with the Internet it's

04:09very limited now with the Internet it's like having a nervous system it's like like having a nervous system it's like like having a nervous system it's like any part of of humanity has access to any part of of humanity has access to any part of of humanity has access to almost all the information of humanity almost all the information of humanity almost all the information of humanity hmm like you could be in the in the hmm like you could be in the in the hmm like you could be in the in the middle of the Amazon jungle uh whether middle of the Amazon jungle uh whether middle of the Amazon jungle uh whether it's a starling terminal and have access it's a starling terminal and have access

04:22it's a starling terminal and have access to more information uh than the to more information uh than the to more information uh than the president did in 1980. right well president did in 1980. right well president did in 1980. right well anything on your phone everything is anything on your phone everything is anything on your phone everything is yeah okay so so you are one of these yeah okay so so you are one of these yeah okay so so you are one of these dealers these people who deal the cards dealers these people who deal the cards dealers these people who deal the cards and I feel some memes too

04:52so I think a lot of people thought when so I think a lot of people thought when you bought Twitter that this is kind of you bought Twitter that this is kind of you bought Twitter that this is kind of an outlier like how does this what an outlier like how does this what an outlier like how does this what doesn't fit with these other things doesn't fit with these other things doesn't fit with these other things you're doing I never thought that you're doing I never thought that you're doing I never thought that because I think you're dealing with big because I think you're dealing with big because I think you're dealing with big civilizational issues and problems and I

05:04civilizational issues and problems and I civilizational issues and problems and I was right on your page I think Twitter was right on your page I think Twitter was right on your page I think Twitter is one of them I mean you have talked is one of them I mean you have talked is one of them I mean you have talked about this at woke mind virus yes and about this at woke mind virus yes and about this at woke mind virus yes and really apocalyptic terms yeah I don't really apocalyptic terms yeah I don't really apocalyptic terms yeah I don't you should explain why you don't think you should explain why you don't think you should explain why you don't think it's hyperbole to say things like it's

05:18it's hyperbole to say things like it's it's hyperbole to say things like it's pushing civilization towards suicide pushing civilization towards suicide pushing civilization towards suicide first of all what is the walk mine virus first of all what is the walk mine virus first of all what is the walk mine virus and if we don't deal with this nothing and if we don't deal with this nothing and if we don't deal with this nothing else can get done tell me why you think else can get done tell me why you think else can get done tell me why you think that that that yeah so yeah so yeah so um um um I think we need to be very cautious I think we need to be very cautious

05:31I think we need to be very cautious about anything that is anti-meritocratic about anything that is anti-meritocratic about anything that is anti-meritocratic and anything that is uh and anything that is uh and anything that is uh that that results in the suppression of that that results in the suppression of that that results in the suppression of a free speech a free speech a free speech so you know those are two other aspects so you know those are two other aspects so you know those are two other aspects of the work mind virus that I think are of the work mind virus that I think are of the work mind virus that I think are very dangerous uh is that it's often

05:48very dangerous uh is that it's often very dangerous uh is that it's often anti-mureaucratic you can't you can't anti-mureaucratic you can't you can't anti-mureaucratic you can't you can't question things uh even the questioning question things uh even the questioning question things uh even the questioning is bad so uh you know you know another is bad so uh you know you know another is bad so uh you know you know another way to way to way to almost Anonymous would we cancel culture almost Anonymous would we cancel culture almost Anonymous would we cancel culture and obviously people try to cancel you and obviously people try to cancel you

06:03and obviously people try to cancel you many times many times yeah I mean every many times many times yeah I mean every many times many times yeah I mean every week yeah week yeah week yeah from left and right I've had it from from left and right I've had it from from left and right I've had it from both sides yeah and it's interesting both sides yeah and it's interesting both sides yeah and it's interesting people you and I are both like in that people you and I are both like in that people you and I are both like in that little group of people maybe it's a little group of people maybe it's a little group of people maybe it's a bigger group now yeah who who are called

06:18bigger group now yeah who who are called bigger group now yeah who who are called conservative who haven't really changed conservative who haven't really changed conservative who haven't really changed I don't see you think of you as a I don't see you think of you as a I don't see you think of you as a conservative definitely conservative definitely conservative definitely yeah like I I at least think of myself yeah like I I at least think of myself yeah like I I at least think of myself as a moderate uh you know uh so I mean as a moderate uh you know uh so I mean as a moderate uh you know uh so I mean uh at least that like I've spent a uh at least that like I've spent a

06:33uh at least that like I've spent a massive amount of My Life Energy massive amount of My Life Energy massive amount of My Life Energy building sustainable energy uh you know building sustainable energy uh you know building sustainable energy uh you know electric vehicles and and batteries and electric vehicles and and batteries and electric vehicles and and batteries and solar and stuff uh to help save the solar and stuff uh to help save the solar and stuff uh to help save the environment that's that's not that's not environment that's that's not that's not environment that's that's not that's not a

06:50it's not exactly far right now you drew it's not exactly far right now you drew that diagram you drew that diagram once that diagram you drew that diagram once that diagram you drew that diagram once where you're here I I related to that where you're here I I related to that where you're here I I related to that and like the world has changed right I and like the world has changed right I and like the world has changed right I feel the same way I feel like very often feel the same way I feel like very often feel the same way I feel like very often wokeness is it's not building on wokeness is it's not building on wokeness is it's not building on liberalism it's the opposite of

07:03liberalism it's the opposite of liberalism it's the opposite of liberalism I can mention yes exactly liberalism I can mention yes exactly liberalism I can mention yes exactly many examples where it's the op many examples where it's the op many examples where it's the op including Free Speech free speech is including Free Speech free speech is including Free Speech free speech is actually is extremely important and it's actually is extremely important and it's actually is extremely important and it's bizarre that we've come to this point bizarre that we've come to this point bizarre that we've come to this point where where where um like free speech used to be a left or

07:16um like free speech used to be a left or um like free speech used to be a left or liberal value and and yet we see uh from liberal value and and yet we see uh from liberal value and and yet we see uh from you know in quotes left uh a desire to you know in quotes left uh a desire to you know in quotes left uh a desire to actually censor actually censor actually censor um and uh um and uh um and uh that seems crazy I mean I think we that seems crazy I mean I think we that seems crazy I mean I think we should be extremely concerned about should be extremely concerned about should be extremely concerned about anything that uh anything that uh

07:35anything that uh undermines the First Amendment there's a undermines the First Amendment there's a undermines the First Amendment there's a reason for the First Amendment reason for the First Amendment reason for the First Amendment um the first amendment is because people um the first amendment is because people um the first amendment is because people came from countries where they could not came from countries where they could not came from countries where they could not speak freely speak freely speak freely and and where and we're saying certain and and where and we're saying certain and and where and we're saying certain things would get you thrown into prison

07:48things would get you thrown into prison things would get you thrown into prison and they were like well we don't want and they were like well we don't want and they were like well we don't want that here that here that here and by the way in many parts of the and by the way in many parts of the and by the way in many parts of the world world world including possible that people might including possible that people might including possible that people might think are relatively similar to the think are relatively similar to the think are relatively similar to the United States the the speech laws are United States the the speech laws are

07:59United States the the speech laws are draconian England is quite different I draconian England is quite different I draconian England is quite different I won't name any countries but won't name any countries but won't name any countries but why are we protecting them they have no why are we protecting them they have no why are we protecting them they have no first first first it's very easy to prove libel in England it's very easy to prove libel in England it's very easy to prove libel in England whereas here it's almost England whereas here it's almost England whereas here it's almost England um um um I wouldn't want to say the wrong thing I wouldn't want to say the wrong thing

08:17I wouldn't want to say the wrong thing or uh yes you could be sued easier there or uh yes you could be sued easier there or uh yes you could be sued easier there I mean there are a lot in in France I I mean there are a lot in in France I I mean there are a lot in in France I think if you deny the Holocaust think if you deny the Holocaust think if you deny the Holocaust which I think is abhorrent but I also which I think is abhorrent but I also which I think is abhorrent but I also think it should be part of free speech think it should be part of free speech think it should be part of free speech right you can be thrown into jail okay right you can be thrown into jail okay

08:31right you can be thrown into jail okay so this my I I really can't emphasize so this my I I really can't emphasize so this my I I really can't emphasize this enough we must uh uh we must this enough we must uh uh we must this enough we must uh uh we must protect free speech and Free Speech only protect free speech and Free Speech only protect free speech and Free Speech only matters it's only relevant when it's matters it's only relevant when it's matters it's only relevant when it's someone you don't like saying something someone you don't like saying something someone you don't like saying something in your life because obviously every in your life because obviously every

08:45in your life because obviously every speech that you like is uh yes that's speech that you like is uh yes that's speech that you like is uh yes that's easy easy easy um so it it's uh and it's the thing um so it it's uh and it's the thing um so it it's uh and it's the thing about censorship is that sure for those about censorship is that sure for those about censorship is that sure for those who would Advocate it um just remember who would Advocate it um just remember who would Advocate it um just remember at some point that will be turned on you at some point that will be turned on you at some point that will be turned on you [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] so so

09:04so this uh woke mind virus how did it start this uh woke mind virus how did it start this uh woke mind virus how did it start was it bats was it a yeah escape from a was it bats was it a yeah escape from a was it bats was it a yeah escape from a lab I mean what is your assessment of lab I mean what is your assessment of lab I mean what is your assessment of what because it's fairly recent why how what because it's fairly recent why how what because it's fairly recent why how did it start and why did it start and why did it start and why I was I was trying to figure out where I was I was trying to figure out where I was I was trying to figure out where where it's coming from I think it's

09:24where it's coming from I think it's where it's coming from I think it's actually been a long time Brewing actually been a long time Brewing actually been a long time Brewing um in that it's uh um in that it's uh um in that it's uh I think it's been going on for a while I think it's been going on for a while I think it's been going on for a while um um um it it and it it and it it and um um um the amount of indoctrination that that's the amount of indoctrination that that's the amount of indoctrination that that's happening in schools and universities is happening in schools and universities is happening in schools and universities is I think far beyond what parents realize

09:43I think far beyond what parents realize I think far beyond what parents realize um and I only I sort of came to realize um and I only I sort of came to realize um and I only I sort of came to realize this somewhat late um this somewhat late um this somewhat late um the the experience that we had uh in the the experience that we had uh in the the experience that we had uh in high school and college is not the high school and college is not the high school and college is not the experience that that kids today are experience that that kids today are experience that that kids today are having having having um and and hasn't been for I don't know um and and hasn't been for I don't know

09:58um and and hasn't been for I don't know 10 years maybe 20 years 10 years maybe 20 years 10 years maybe 20 years so so so uh my parents themselves also a big part uh my parents themselves also a big part uh my parents themselves also a big part of the problem of the problem of the problem they well I I suppose in some cases that they well I I suppose in some cases that they well I I suppose in some cases that parents but but I think like the parents parents but but I think like the parents parents but but I think like the parents are just generally not aware of what are just generally not aware of what are just generally not aware of what their their kids are being told or what

10:15their their kids are being told or what their their kids are being told or what they're not being taught they're not being taught they're not being taught um they're letting the kids think that um they're letting the kids think that um they're letting the kids think that they're equal I mean yeah let me let me they're equal I mean yeah let me let me they're equal I mean yeah let me let me let me give you an example that a let me give you an example that a let me give you an example that a Fairmont told me which uh you know his Fairmont told me which uh you know his Fairmont told me which uh you know his daughters uh go to college and and sorry daughters uh go to college and and sorry

10:28daughters uh go to college and and sorry go to high school in the Bay Area go to high school in the Bay Area go to high school in the Bay Area um and um um and um um and um and he he was asking them like well so and he he was asking them like well so and he he was asking them like well so who are the who are the who are the you know who are the first few you know who are the first few you know who are the first few presidents of the United States uh that presidents of the United States uh that presidents of the United States uh that they could name Washington but and I they could name Washington but and I they could name Washington but and I said what do you know about him well he

10:42said what do you know about him well he said what do you know about him well he was a slave owner what else right was a slave owner what else right was a slave owner what else right exactly nothing exactly nothing exactly nothing right like uh okay that's maybe you right like uh okay that's maybe you right like uh okay that's maybe you should know more than that you know yeah should know more than that you know yeah should know more than that you know yeah yeah that and that that is the world yeah that and that that is the world yeah that and that that is the world mind virus exactly yeah so mind virus exactly yeah so mind virus exactly yeah so exactly it's it's like you know the uh

11:02exactly it's it's like you know the uh exactly it's it's like you know the uh you know slavery is obviously a horrific you know slavery is obviously a horrific you know slavery is obviously a horrific institution but we should still know institution but we should still know institution but we should still know more about George Washington than that more about George Washington than that more about George Washington than that and by the way one that was practiced and by the way one that was practiced and by the way one that was practiced all over the world forever since the all over the world forever since the all over the world forever since the beginning of time by every race

11:13beginning of time by every race beginning of time by every race including people of color I'm sorry to including people of color I'm sorry to including people of color I'm sorry to tell you that it's huge in the Bible tell you that it's huge in the Bible tell you that it's huge in the Bible absolutely so the Bible loves it absolutely so the Bible loves it absolutely so the Bible loves it really yes they're quite strict about really yes they're quite strict about really yes they're quite strict about like you know don't take someone else's like you know don't take someone else's like you know don't take someone else's slave and that kind of thing right but

11:27slave and that kind of thing right but slave and that kind of thing right but no one ever says just don't do it they no one ever says just don't do it they no one ever says just don't do it they don't they don't they don't at no point don't they don't they don't at no point don't they don't they don't at no point does it say slavery is bad in the Bible does it say slavery is bad in the Bible does it say slavery is bad in the Bible no they do not condemn it at all they no they do not condemn it at all they no they do not condemn it at all they just have so so it's um but Twitter is just have so so it's um but Twitter is

11:39just have so so it's um but Twitter is not doing bad right I mean I saw today not doing bad right I mean I saw today not doing bad right I mean I saw today that Tucker Carlson yeah recently fired that Tucker Carlson yeah recently fired that Tucker Carlson yeah recently fired you were just on his show and he lost you were just on his show and he lost you were just on his show and he lost his job so I hope this isn't enough yeah his job so I hope this isn't enough yeah his job so I hope this isn't enough yeah yeah but uh luckily uh the angel of yeah but uh luckily uh the angel of yeah but uh luckily uh the angel of death exactly I'm not the Typhoid Mary death exactly I'm not the Typhoid Mary

11:55death exactly I'm not the Typhoid Mary of uh talk shows uh

12:03his rant yesterday or today on Twitter his rant yesterday or today on Twitter yesterday or something more than every yesterday or something more than every yesterday or something more than every cable news monologue or something like cable news monologue or something like cable news monologue or something like that is that right well Twitter has a that is that right well Twitter has a that is that right well Twitter has a tremendous audience so there's 250 tremendous audience so there's 250 tremendous audience so there's 250 million people that spend an average of million people that spend an average of million people that spend an average of half an hour a day on Twitter so it's

12:17half an hour a day on Twitter so it's half an hour a day on Twitter so it's about 120 to 130 million user hours per about 120 to 130 million user hours per about 120 to 130 million user hours per day and it's been increasing so day and it's been increasing so day and it's been increasing so um the we didn't do anything to be clear um the we didn't do anything to be clear um the we didn't do anything to be clear we did nothing special whatsoever I we did nothing special whatsoever I we did nothing special whatsoever I learned about it afterwards that he had learned about it afterwards that he had learned about it afterwards that he had posted something on Twitter um so it's

12:32posted something on Twitter um so it's posted something on Twitter um so it's just the Twitter has a lot of people's just the Twitter has a lot of people's just the Twitter has a lot of people's attention uh so and it tends to be the attention uh so and it tends to be the attention uh so and it tends to be the people that are uh that read read a lot people that are uh that read read a lot people that are uh that read read a lot or or interested in current events or or interested in current events or or interested in current events um and um um and um um and um generally are pretty influential so but generally are pretty influential so but

12:47generally are pretty influential so but most of the people who tweet are the most of the people who tweet are the most of the people who tweet are the same people right I mean the people who same people right I mean the people who same people right I mean the people who actually tweet it's mostly just reading actually tweet it's mostly just reading actually tweet it's mostly just reading it yeah I feel like that's I've read it yeah I feel like that's I've read it yeah I feel like that's I've read this many times it's a very very small this many times it's a very very small this many times it's a very very small percentage of the people on Twitter and percentage of the people on Twitter and

12:59percentage of the people on Twitter and it seems like yeah see here's why I it seems like yeah see here's why I it seems like yeah see here's why I don't tweet anymore because you may be don't tweet anymore because you may be don't tweet anymore because you may be the mayor of tweak town now yeah the mayor of tweak town now yeah the mayor of tweak town now yeah I'm getting a cap with that and I'm glad I'm getting a cap with that and I'm glad I'm getting a cap with that and I'm glad and I like it that the mayor likes my and I like it that the mayor likes my and I like it that the mayor likes my jokes but the reason I don't do it jokes but the reason I don't do it

13:12jokes but the reason I don't do it anymore is because the mob of Mean Girls anymore is because the mob of Mean Girls anymore is because the mob of Mean Girls is still there and that has not changed is still there and that has not changed is still there and that has not changed I know like it's too easy to get I know like it's too easy to get I know like it's too easy to get canceled canceled canceled and I don't even know what pisses them and I don't even know what pisses them and I don't even know what pisses them off they're so nuts these kids I feel off they're so nuts these kids I feel off they're so nuts these kids I feel like I'm walking on a roof with a

13:29like I'm walking on a roof with a like I'm walking on a roof with a blindfold I could fall off anytime yeah blindfold I could fall off anytime yeah blindfold I could fall off anytime yeah that was the most innocuous thing but that was the most innocuous thing but that was the most innocuous thing but it's like you know I said George it's like you know I said George it's like you know I said George Washington was a great president oh how Washington was a great president oh how Washington was a great president oh how dare you yeah yeah exactly had some dare you yeah yeah exactly had some dare you yeah yeah exactly had some flows but but how do you fix this flows but but how do you fix this

13:42flows but but how do you fix this instrumental in this Mr Mayor creation instrumental in this Mr Mayor creation instrumental in this Mr Mayor creation of the United States so yeah of the United States so yeah of the United States so yeah um well you have to say like what does um well you have to say like what does um well you have to say like what does canceled mean you know uh I mean it's canceled mean you know uh I mean it's canceled mean you know uh I mean it's yes people attacking on Twitter that's yes people attacking on Twitter that's yes people attacking on Twitter that's one thing but frankly that's just going one thing but frankly that's just going

13:54one thing but frankly that's just going to increase engagement to increase engagement to increase engagement so I would just ignore it well that's so I would just ignore it well that's so I would just ignore it well that's easy for you because they can't take easy for you because they can't take easy for you because they can't take your job away your job away your job away or any of your main 10 jobs but they or any of your main 10 jobs but they or any of your main 10 jobs but they could take mine and they did Once by the could take mine and they did Once by the could take mine and they did Once by the way yeah so still Affair you know I was way yeah so still Affair you know I was

14:08way yeah so still Affair you know I was like literally canceled yeah I mean like like literally canceled yeah I mean like like literally canceled yeah I mean like the Show is canceled the Show is canceled the Show is canceled so you but okay so you were in Congress so you but okay so you were in Congress so you but okay so you were in Congress uh at Congress the other day talking uh at Congress the other day talking uh at Congress the other day talking with Chuck Schumer about AI I'm very with Chuck Schumer about AI I'm very with Chuck Schumer about AI I'm very interested in this because you've been interested in this because you've been

14:21interested in this because you've been on this for years I've always thought on this for years I've always thought on this for years I've always thought you were right about this I think you're you were right about this I think you're you were right about this I think you're right about almost everything I mean right about almost everything I mean right about almost everything I mean let's have more babies and raise them on let's have more babies and raise them on let's have more babies and raise them on Mars I don't get that but okay well uh I Mars I don't get that but okay well uh I Mars I don't get that but okay well uh I just think we should be cautious about

14:33just think we should be cautious about just think we should be cautious about civilizational decline with with and we civilizational decline with with and we civilizational decline with with and we have plummeting growth rates have plummeting growth rates have plummeting growth rates um most places yeah right and also um most places yeah right and also um most places yeah right and also plummeting resources no no resources plummeting resources no no resources plummeting resources no no resources will be fine

14:49look I'm not suggesting complacency but look I'm not suggesting complacency but we do want to move to a sustainable we do want to move to a sustainable we do want to move to a sustainable energy economy as quickly as possible energy economy as quickly as possible energy economy as quickly as possible but but we're not in any danger of uh but but we're not in any danger of uh but but we're not in any danger of uh resource collapse but lots of people resource collapse but lots of people resource collapse but lots of people don't have enough food or water don't have enough food or water don't have enough food or water we will run out of water they're running

15:03we will run out of water they're running we will run out of water they're running they're running out of sand they're running out of sand they're running out of sand Earth is 70 Water by surface area Earth is 70 Water by surface area Earth is 70 Water by surface area um but you can't drink that um but you can't drink that um but you can't drink that desalination is absurdly Chief why don't desalination is absurdly Chief why don't desalination is absurdly Chief why don't we do it then we do it is you have a lot we do it then we do it is you have a lot we do it then we do it is you have a lot of free time it is done this there is a of free time it is done this there is a

15:18of free time it is done this there is a lot of desalination done okay but lot of desalination done okay but lot of desalination done okay but there's plenty of water this is not an there's plenty of water this is not an there's plenty of water this is not an issue I want to be clear all right so issue I want to be clear all right so issue I want to be clear all right so but let's talk about AI because like you but let's talk about AI because like you but let's talk about AI because like you were you were on this tip 10 years ago were you were on this tip 10 years ago were you were on this tip 10 years ago when nobody else was that and I always when nobody else was that and I always

15:28when nobody else was that and I always thought he's right why because I've seen thought he's right why because I've seen thought he's right why because I've seen too many movies everything that happens too many movies everything that happens too many movies everything that happens in movies that happens in real life and in movies that happens in real life and in movies that happens in real life and yeah you know if you make things that yeah you know if you make things that yeah you know if you make things that are way smarter than you why wouldn't are way smarter than you why wouldn't are way smarter than you why wouldn't they become your overlords so what did

15:41they become your overlords so what did they become your overlords so what did you say to Chuck Schumer and what are we you say to Chuck Schumer and what are we you say to Chuck Schumer and what are we doing about this I know you want to doing about this I know you want to doing about this I know you want to pause in AI because in the just in the pause in AI because in the just in the pause in AI because in the just in the last six months with chat GPT which came last six months with chat GPT which came last six months with chat GPT which came from a company you started from a company you started from a company you started yes yes yes [Laughter] [Laughter]

15:55[Laughter] um well I mean A friend of mine has a um well I mean A friend of mine has a um well I mean A friend of mine has a sort of modification of Occam's razor sort of modification of Occam's razor sort of modification of Occam's razor you know you know instead of the you know you know instead of the you know you know instead of the simplest thing being the most likely simplest thing being the most likely simplest thing being the most likely that like the most ironic outcome is that like the most ironic outcome is that like the most ironic outcome is most likely right right yes so most likely right right yes so most likely right right yes so um with respect to AI um with respect to AI

16:11um with respect to AI um I just think we should be uh we um I just think we should be uh we um I just think we should be uh we should have some sort of regulatory should have some sort of regulatory should have some sort of regulatory oversight so uh you know for anything oversight so uh you know for anything oversight so uh you know for anything that is a danger to the public uh if that is a danger to the public uh if that is a danger to the public uh if it's sort of uh aircraft uh cars uh Food it's sort of uh aircraft uh cars uh Food it's sort of uh aircraft uh cars uh Food and Drug and whatnot we've got some and Drug and whatnot we've got some

16:22and Drug and whatnot we've got some regulatory oversight like a referee regulatory oversight like a referee regulatory oversight like a referee essentially and making sure that uh essentially and making sure that uh essentially and making sure that uh companies don't cut Corners so companies don't cut Corners so companies don't cut Corners so um um um I think that since if one agrees that uh I think that since if one agrees that uh I think that since if one agrees that uh AI is a potential risk to the public AI is a potential risk to the public AI is a potential risk to the public then there should be some regulatory then there should be some regulatory

16:37then there should be some regulatory body that oversees uh what companies are body that oversees uh what companies are body that oversees uh what companies are doing so they don't cut corners and doing so they don't cut corners and doing so they don't cut corners and potentially do something very dangerous

16:49don't do something don't do something lay out a scenario for me in the next lay out a scenario for me in the next lay out a scenario for me in the next two five ten years if nothing is done two five ten years if nothing is done two five ten years if nothing is done because we're very good at doing nothing because we're very good at doing nothing because we're very good at doing nothing especially when it comes in the way of especially when it comes in the way of especially when it comes in the way of profit and this is a big profit engine profit and this is a big profit engine profit and this is a big profit engine now for companies they're going to want

17:01now for companies they're going to want now for companies they're going to want to just compete with each other I mean to just compete with each other I mean to just compete with each other I mean there are people like Ray Kurzweil who there are people like Ray Kurzweil who there are people like Ray Kurzweil who doesn't think it's a problem at all uh doesn't think it's a problem at all uh doesn't think it's a problem at all uh actually Ray kurzweil's prediction for actually Ray kurzweil's prediction for actually Ray kurzweil's prediction for artificial super intelligence uh is artificial super intelligence uh is artificial super intelligence uh is 2029. he's not far wrong right but he

17:152029. he's not far wrong right but he 2029. he's not far wrong right but he doesn't think it's a problem whereas doesn't think it's a problem whereas doesn't think it's a problem whereas people like you and Bill Gates and people like you and Bill Gates and people like you and Bill Gates and Stephen Hawking thought think it's a Stephen Hawking thought think it's a Stephen Hawking thought think it's a problem problem problem um yeah it depends if some people want um yeah it depends if some people want um yeah it depends if some people want to live forever or for a much longer to live forever or for a much longer to live forever or for a much longer period of time and they see AI as the

17:28period of time and they see AI as the period of time and they see AI as the only way to or only way to or only way to or digital super intelligence is as the digital super intelligence is as the digital super intelligence is as the only thing that can figure out how to only thing that can figure out how to only thing that can figure out how to get them to live forever I think get them to live forever I think get them to live forever I think Kurzweil is in that category so he would Kurzweil is in that category so he would Kurzweil is in that category so he would prefer to have ai prefer to have ai prefer to have ai artificial general intelligence than artificial general intelligence than

17:40artificial general intelligence than than not uh because it can figure out than not uh because it can figure out than not uh because it can figure out longevity longevity longevity so are you are you optimistic I read in so are you are you optimistic I read in so are you are you optimistic I read in your Rolling Stone article back in the your Rolling Stone article back in the your Rolling Stone article back in the day that you said you can never be happy day that you said you can never be happy day that you said you can never be happy unless you're in love unless you're in love unless you're in love well you can be half happy I suppose well you can be half happy I suppose

17:56well you can be half happy I suppose I mean this I mean there's two things I I mean this I mean there's two things I I mean this I mean there's two things I think if to be to be full to be to be think if to be to be full to be to be think if to be to be full to be to be most happy if you're happy in love and most happy if you're happy in love and most happy if you're happy in love and and you love your work then then you'll and you love your work then then you'll and you love your work then then you'll be I think fully happy if you lack be I think fully happy if you lack be I think fully happy if you lack either of those two if you have one of either of those two if you have one of

18:09either of those two if you have one of those two things be half happy you know those two things be half happy you know those two things be half happy you know roughly I feel like the theme in a lot roughly I feel like the theme in a lot roughly I feel like the theme in a lot of your works that connect all these of your works that connect all these of your works that connect all these different things is connecting different things is connecting different things is connecting like you want to connect things you know like you want to connect things you know like you want to connect things you know you want to connect on the hyperloop and you want to connect on the hyperloop and

18:22you want to connect on the hyperloop and you want to connect this to Mars and you want to connect this to Mars and you want to connect this to Mars and even to connect four even to connect four even to connect four people in that game what uh Connect Four people in that game what uh Connect Four people in that game what uh Connect Four you know you know you know [Laughter]

18:47it's hard for you because when you it's hard for you because when you bought Twitter you're kind of doing what bought Twitter you're kind of doing what bought Twitter you're kind of doing what you did when you took over when you you did when you took over when you you did when you took over when you started Tesla you lived at the factory started Tesla you lived at the factory started Tesla you lived at the factory right I feel like that's your that's right I feel like that's your that's right I feel like that's your that's your your your pattern you get into this your your your pattern you get into this your your your pattern you get into this thing and then you got to live at the

19:01thing and then you got to live at the thing and then you got to live at the factory to make it work if you've been factory to make it work if you've been factory to make it work if you've been back in you moved to Texas then you went back in you moved to Texas then you went back in you moved to Texas then you went back up to San Francisco because of back up to San Francisco because of back up to San Francisco because of Twitter I just I was living in the in Twitter I just I was living in the in Twitter I just I was living in the in the library of Twitter for a while the library of Twitter for a while the library of Twitter for a while um yes but it's I think things are

19:15um yes but it's I think things are um yes but it's I think things are reasonably stabilized right now it was reasonably stabilized right now it was reasonably stabilized right now it was uh just on the fast track to bankruptcy uh just on the fast track to bankruptcy uh just on the fast track to bankruptcy after that position so I had to take a after that position so I had to take a after that position so I had to take a drastic action there wasn't any choice drastic action there wasn't any choice drastic action there wasn't any choice I'm just saying it's hard for a woman I'm just saying it's hard for a woman I'm just saying it's hard for a woman yeah to like when the guy lives at the

19:27yeah to like when the guy lives at the yeah to like when the guy lives at the factory factory factory yes that could be that could be a stumbling that could be that could be a stumbling block but yes but block but yes but block but yes but um overall with you know my my concern um overall with you know my my concern um overall with you know my my concern with Twitter was to that it is somewhat with Twitter was to that it is somewhat with Twitter was to that it is somewhat of the digital Town Square and um it's of the digital Town Square and um it's of the digital Town Square and um it's it's important that there be both the it's important that there be both the

19:47it's important that there be both the reality uh and perception of of trust uh reality uh and perception of of trust uh reality uh and perception of of trust uh for a wide range of viewpoints for a wide range of viewpoints for a wide range of viewpoints um and um and um and uh there was a lot of censorship going uh there was a lot of censorship going uh there was a lot of censorship going on on on um and we've we sort of uncovered a lot um and we've we sort of uncovered a lot um and we've we sort of uncovered a lot of that with uh the Twitter files of that with uh the Twitter files of that with uh the Twitter files including a lot of of government-driven

20:02including a lot of of government-driven including a lot of of government-driven censorship which censorship which censorship which you know

20:10it's it's I mean it seems that that's it's it's I mean it seems that that's got to be a constitutional violation of got to be a constitutional violation of got to be a constitutional violation of what was going on there but what was going on there but what was going on there but um so so and I can since I'm like I have um so so and I can since I'm like I have um so so and I can since I'm like I have a Twitter user I could detect that like a Twitter user I could detect that like a Twitter user I could detect that like something's not right here um and so something's not right here um and so something's not right here um and so that's that's really why uh I did that

20:22that's that's really why uh I did that that's that's really why uh I did that position it wasn't because I thought position it wasn't because I thought position it wasn't because I thought this was an easy way to make money or this was an easy way to make money or this was an easy way to make money or something like that it was a man this is something like that it was a man this is something like that it was a man this is being mayor Twitter town tweetown or being mayor Twitter town tweetown or being mayor Twitter town tweetown or whatever is is is definitely like whatever is is is definitely like whatever is is is definitely like there's a lot of arrows pointed at you

20:33there's a lot of arrows pointed at you there's a lot of arrows pointed at you like flying at you of course but you like flying at you of course but you like flying at you of course but you know but you seem to handle that okay I know but you seem to handle that okay I know but you seem to handle that okay I hope you do because yeah hope you do because yeah hope you do because yeah look I mean Geniuses are going to be a look I mean Geniuses are going to be a look I mean Geniuses are going to be a little quirky sometimes but your heart little quirky sometimes but your heart little quirky sometimes but your heart is always in the right place you were is always in the right place you were

20:47is always in the right place you were trying to fix this world and look I trying to fix this world and look I trying to fix this world and look I could talk to you forever we can't today could talk to you forever we can't today could talk to you forever we can't today I'd love to get high with you I know a I'd love to get high with you I know a I'd love to get high with you I know a great place great place great place I can't tell you how much I appreciate I can't tell you how much I appreciate I can't tell you how much I appreciate you I know you have a lot of choices and you I know you have a lot of choices and you I know you have a lot of choices and places you can go thank you Elon Musk

21:01places you can go thank you Elon Musk places you can go thank you Elon Musk ladies and gentlemen all right I'll see ladies and gentlemen all right I'll see ladies and gentlemen all right I'll see you soon